How to Work With and Lead People Not Like You

Every business and organization wants to do better and be better. A proven way to accomplish this is to have employees with diverse backgrounds and perspectives because they can serve different customers and clients in meaningful ways. But our differences can often create friction. Different people may not see eye-to-eye on an issue. Their communication styles may be very different. Their comfort in working with technology may be miles apart. Cultural backgrounds and norms can differ. Even men and women can see situations differently. How do you work alongside someone who may be quite different from you, respect those differences, and be effective in your role? "How to Work with and Lead People Not Like You" shows how to navigate a complex work environment, build trust and solve problems, no matter how different people are from one another. The result is business growth, higher profits and greater customer satisfaction and loyalty. What you'll learn You'll learn why diversity at work is important but why it seems so hard to work with people not like you. And why does that make you NORMAL, not a bad person? You'll learn why it often comes with stress, complex emotions and even fear for some people. Specific tactics will be shared for how anyone can succeed in today's diverse workplace without losing their mind or becoming frustrated by approaches to work that may differ from theirs. The four keywords that will transform how you interact with your colleagues and associates in tough situations to get the best outcome. The one phrase that will smooth over every mistake or problem – every time.

Transcription:

Eric Silverman (00:09):

My name's Eric Silverman. I'm excited to be here. And this guy, who are you?

Ed Ligonde (00:15):

Well speak for yourself buddy. I'm Ed Ligonde, and as Eric mentioned, we're part of the advisory council for EBN, probably 10th on the list of who should replace Alyssa

Eric Silverman (00:28):

11th.

Ed Ligonde (00:29):

So we're stuck to these notes right now. But anyway, super excited to be here in sunny San Diego. I just got back from Europe actually, so I'm extremely jet lagged, but first world problems, right?

Eric Silverman (00:41):

Exactly. I did not just get back from Europe and I'm also not naturally this tan. You don't get this tan from being out in the sun. So just keep that in mind. You will see me indoors at all times. So this is going to be a really fun event. My background with this conference is long and vast. I've been in the benefits world for 25 years and about 11, 12 years ago I was asked to join the then board and now the, I think they call it a council, but same thing. And I really love this conference and I love all the different events. So I'm really fired up that you're here today and we are not, as you can see, we're not professional MCs. So we are absolutely going to look at these papers a little bit to make sure we get all of our notes.

(01:26):

Otherwise we're going to get fired, then we won't get paid the money That's not coming anyway, so we'll be good to go. Alright, so a couple things. One, throughout the week, obviously there's going to be a lot of great content. Look, you guys came here for a reason, right? Please go to the events, go to each breakout session that you believe is going to be best for you and your business and your situation, what you're looking for for fourth quarter and 2025. There's going to be tremendous speakers if you've ever spoken on stage. So anybody here ever spoken on stage, raise your hand, keep your hand up if you know it's terrible when your room doesn't have anybody in there

(02:07):

And you get depressed and you start to suck your thumb and you start to cry a little bit, alright? Don't be that guy or that lady. Please support our speakers. Make sure you're networking for sure, but make sure you come into the rooms and support everybody. So let's see. The exhibitor hall, if you haven't already figured it out, is right here. Let's remember if it wasn't for our exhibitors, our sponsors, our partners, I call them solution providers, we wouldn't have this conference. We'd all literally still be stuck on Zoom or Teams doing a conference like this. Virtually. Anybody remember that? Just a few years ago? How fun was that? Not right? So please make sure you support them. They're there to help us, all of us make sure we can do better for our employee team members. Let's see. We have plenty of breaks, guys, so you don't need to worry throughout the two days there's going to be snacks, there's going to be coffee and desserts, there's going to be other things toward the evening hours. So you're going to be well hydrated, I assure you. And then tonight there's going to be cocktails in the exhibitor hall space and tomorrow night as well. Ed, are you going to do anything here?

Ed Ligonde (03:19):

You should. Let me talk typical Eric anyways, before you can get your drink on and get your buzz on. So during lunch today, we're obviously going to have some really great food, but I'm really excited about the EBNs best HR team showcase as well. So you're going to learn about some of the best HR teams that are out there and just really excited. I'm a big believer that HR is the heartbeat of organizations, so just excited to give you your kudos along the way. Tons of different networking opportunities with the sponsors, with each other. Get out of your comfort zone, meet someone new, and just make sure you're getting some lasting connections. And then after that in this room, not only this morning in the afternoon and flanking the conversations later tomorrow as well in the general sessions, tons of different topics, mental health, employee retention, employee benefits, workplace culture, tons of different topics out there. And again, as Eric mentioned, let's try to fill those rooms and support the speakers who are taking time out of their day just as much as you are too. So don't feel like you need to remember everything I'm saying. There's tons of smiling faces in the back and well, if he smiles, then we can just kind of point you in the right direction along the way.

Eric Silverman (04:32):

So we're going to have our popular whiteboarding session. Anybody who was here last year, we do a really fun whiteboarding session. It's backed by popular demand. It's going to be just before the cocktail reception later today. Please make sure you attend tomorrow, right? We're just starting today, but I got to remind you about tomorrow. Tomorrow. Don't miss the peer-to-peer round tables just before lunch and then tomorrow as well. When we close out the conference, I have the pleasure of, I don't want to even call it moderating. We're going to do a really cool town hall session. We're going to have mikes all around the room and we want you to ask questions to my two esteemed colleagues and partners, Erica Ine and David Contorno as we close out tomorrow, late afternoon. So I'm super fired up about that. So I will be here on stage again. I know. Awesome. And don't let me, Erica or David down. And we're going to be discussing key trends and predictions for 2025 and beyond.

Ed Ligonde (05:25):

So before I introduce our keynote speakers, I definitely don't want to overstate our welcome up here. Just a couple quick housekeeping items. Those of you who are shrm, CP SCP certified, first of all, congrats because that's just hard as heck to get, so congrats on getting that. But don't forget to get your credits along the way as well. So there's going to be people going into each session that can help kind of scan you in. Make sure you get those credits as well.

Eric Silverman (05:50):

Don't you love when on video? Ed loves this. He's actually kind of shy. Give it up for Ed Ligonde, guys, I'm pretty shy too. Alright, I already talked about our sponsors, make sure you support them. I appreciate all that they do. If you haven't already downloaded the conference app, go to your app store horizon, search it and pull up the first one that pops up. Benefits at work, pretty easy. Log right in and you'll be ready to go. And of course if you have any questions, just ask Ed.

Ed Ligonde (06:21):

Yeah, I think you're probably right about that one. Anyways, without further ado, again, I'm just extremely excited, honored to be here with all of you, especially in a wonderful city, wonderful venue, tons of amazing smiling faces and some smart people here. And again, really excited to introduce our keynote speaker who you're really here to see. So just shut up here in a second is Kelly McDonald. She is an Author and an amazing expert around multicultural marketing business trends. And I absolutely love the topic of our session. It kind of reminds me of the Kendrick Lamar song. They not like us. If anybody has heard that song, all I hear is that song on TikTok, on replay. But anyways, she came up with that first. So anyways, without further ado, Kelly McDonald.

Kelly McDonald (07:14):

I love your pink shoe laces. Apparently it's the color of the day. Hi everybody. Hi. Before we get rolling, I just have to give a shout out to Brady Weisenberger. Can you just stand or raise your hand back there? Come on, Brady. I got to tell you, why do you know this guy? He's from North Dakota and obviously he's an attendee. He bought me an iced coffee this morning and he doesn't know me. I know. So there's a guy that was sitting at his table, had an iced coffee and I said, Hey, where did you get that? And he goes, oh, at the coffee shop, blah, blah, blah. And I said, okay, cool. And I made a joke and I said, I'll give you a hundred dollars for it. And then Brady goes, no, I'll go get you one. And I was like, no, no, I was just kidding. I was just kidding. And he was like, no, what do you want? And I was like, no, no, no, no, seriously, I'm good. And he is like, no, I'm going to get you a coffee. And he did.

(08:11):

So I've been sipping on it over here. So if I'm a little more jacked up than normal, it's because of Brady. I want to tell you that you are all going to get a copy of this presentation. It's pretty high content, so you don't need to take any notes or anything. You can just kick back and drink your Jack and Coke or whatever that is. And can we just relax and have a good time? Alright, so how many of you are working with people who are not like you? However you want to define the not like youness, right? Is everybody in the room? Every one of us is working with people not like us. And so that's what I'm going to be talking about today, and I'm going to give you some very specific actionable skills that you can apply to make that easier and smoother.

(08:52):

Because when we're working with people who are just like us, it's really easy. We get them, they get us, we see eye to eye. There's really no difference in viewpoint or perspective or anything like that. But when we're working with people not like us, there can be a little bit of friction. So I want to start with a little bit of just table setting. This is brand new July of 2024, fresh information with something that very few people know anything about. And that is that the census, the US census has been tracking diversity in the United States for decades with what they call the diversity index. And it's very simple what this means. It means if I grab any two people at random anywhere in the United States, what's the likelihood that those two people will be of different races or ethnicities? Now I will tell you this, they call it the diversity index.

(09:41):

And it only encompasses from the census perspective, race and ethnicity, not gender, not age, not any of the other ways that we can be different from one another. But it's a start. So as you can see here, in 1980, if I grabbed any two people at random anywhere in the United States, I had a 34% chance that they would be of different races or ethnicities or in other words, I had a 66% chance that they were going to be of the same race, probably white because that's what the composition of the United States population was primarily at that point, majority white. But look how fast has changed in just a few decades, we've gone from a 34% probability to a 61% probability with the last census. Now they get the 2024 data because the census only comes out once every 10 years. Well, the census doesn't just do a census and then just kick back and relax for nine years.

(10:30):

They're continuously updating their reports and their forecast. And so now the United States, if I grab any two people at random anywhere in the us, I have a 73% chance that they're going to be of different races or ethnicities. So there are two very big macro trends that are going on on this very simple slide. The first one is we're becoming more diverse. That's clear. The second one is we're becoming more diverse more quickly. So between 1980 and 1990, it took 10 years to move the diversity index by six percentage points, then seven, then five. But between 2010 and 2020, the diversity index grew by a whopping nine percentage points. And in the last four years, it's forecasted that it's grown by another 12 percentage points. So this is not a fad, it's a trend. The difference between a fad and a trend is fads come and go.

(11:20):

Like fashion trends don't come and go. They are shifts. And once they shift, they rarely shift back. And that concludes my presentation. Thank you. Now, so in the United States, we're not the same everywhere. So I just wanted to give you, none of this is going to surprise you. I just wanted to give you the top five most and least diverse states. It won't surprise you. The most diverse states are California, Texas, New Mexico, Nevada, and New Jersey. And the least diverse states are also no surprise, Montana, New Hampshire, Vermont, West Virginia, and Maine. So the way that you interpret this is if I grab anybody at random, let's say in New Mexico, I have an 84% chance that those two people would be of different races or ethnicities. Whereas if I grab any two people at random in Maine, I only have a 22% chance that they're going to be of different races or ethnicities in Maine, I have a 78% chance that they're going to be of the same race, probably white because New England is very, very white.

(12:21):

So no surprise here. And here is a map of the United States where you can see where you are, where your friends and family and loved ones are, and all of the different diversity indices for the various states. So we have diversity within diversity, but I do not like to actually use the D word. I don't like the word diversity because I think diversity is any way that you can be different from me, right? So do you have children? I do. You do? Okay, so I don't, so just go with me here. Okay, play along. We're both women, okay? Let's just say we're the same age. I know you're younger. Don't be a hater, okay? Just say we're the same age. Let's say we're the same race. Let's say we live in the same zip code. And let's even say that we make the same household income on paper.

(13:17):

You and I would look the same demographically. And I know that if you have kids, and I don't, we're actually going to be really different in ways that have nothing to do with age, gender, race, ethnicity, anything like that. It has to do with parenthood and non parenthood. So I want you as I'm going through this presentation today, to think about people not like you in any way that makes sense to you. Here's some ways that diversity can show up. What about, especially at work, what about people who like to work alone? Some people do their very best work alone. Just tell me what to do and I'll do it. And if I have any questions, I'll let you know. Leave me alone. Other people are more collaborative and they do their best work working with other people, ideating, brainstorming, lemme say the people who like to work alone.

(14:04):

Let me see the people who like to work more collaboratively. That's why you're at a conference. Yeah, I want to go where people are. Neither of these are right or wrong. They're just different neurodiversity. If you haven't heard much about neurodiversity, you're going to continue to hear more about it. It's about the diversity within the brain. It encompasses disorders of course, like a DHD, autism, Tourette's, et cetera, bipolar, but also different thinking styles. And this particular guy uses a wheelchair for his mobility. So he very clearly has a disability. It's clear, but my husband has severe hearing loss, okay? He's like one clickup from deaf. I know that sounds mean, but that's what his audiologist said. You're one clickup from deaf. So he wears hearing devices and that gets him to about 95% of normal hearing. But my point is you can't look at my husband and tell that he has a disability because those little hearing devices are so little.

(14:59):

And so just keep this in mind that not all disabilities are as visible as this guy. What about just self-expression, blue hair, tats, piercings, et cetera. Jewelry, self-expression is a way that we can be different from one another. Religious differences, Christianity, Judaism, Islam, Hinduism, Sikh, Buddhism, and dozens and dozens more family structure. Gay couples with children, gay couples without children, straight couples with children, straight couples without children. Any way that we can be in different family structures, single parents, blended families, multiracial families. And a whopping 12% of the US population is now considered are those families where the grandparents are raising their grandchildren either fully or partially 12% of the population. That's a huge shift. And here's some other ways that you might not have thought about diversity that definitely show up at work. What about introverts and extroverts? I'm an extrovert. Can you tell?

(16:02):

My husband is an introvert. He's an extreme introvert. He hates people and he does. I mean when the doorbell rings and he is like, can you get it? He'd be a hermit if I let him. So let me see the extroverts in the room. Let me see the introverts. They're like, no, I'm not raising my head. Okay, what about creative versus analytical thinking? An actuary is very different than someone who's in sales, right? An engineer thinks very differently than a graphic designer. So we can just be different with our thinking styles. Morning people and night owls. Let me see the morning people. Let me see the night owls. I do not want to be in the bar with you tonight. You're going to wait. Let me see the night owls again. I have to tell, okay, night owls, you can put your hands out. I have to tell you, I feel sorry for you. And here's why Would you not agree that the working world is not set up for you? Look at this. A keynote starts at eight 30 in the morning and you're like, we don't get rolling until 10.

(17:05):

She's like, preach it. Generational differences in perceptions of good service. Okay? My 86-year-old mother, her idea of an awesome customer experience would be to go to your office to have a meeting all afternoon, all afternoon. She's got nothing else to do, right? It would fill her day. She'd think that was wonderful. And all the rest of us would be like, why do I even have to go to your office? What are we talking about? Why can't you just text me? Right? Rural and metro, right? Someone who lives on a ranch in Wyoming is very different than someone who lives in a loft in Manhattan. Communication styles face-to-face or email and texting. And the big one folks, the one that divides us all right now, so divisive and we just don't get how the other side sees things. It's the big one. Apple people, Google people.

(17:58):

So divisive. You're either one or the other. Okay? So those are some ways that show up at work. So why are we talking about this? Why is it important to work with people who are not like us? Because if we, and is this not the creepiest image you've ever seen? If we work with people who are just like us, it actually leads to the same way of looking at things and the same solutions because there is no one, excuse me, there is no one at the table to introduce a new idea because no one has a different perspective. Everybody sees things the same way. That's why companies that have a lot of older, or what we call legacy employees who have a lot of legacy employees will say, well, this is the way we've always done it. Because there isn't anybody new and fresh at the table to go, Hey, I have an idea.

(18:46):

So this is actually a real problem for business, but let's get real different. Can be uncomfortable. It can be hard to work with someone who's not like you. In fact, one of the things that as a professional speaker, people will tell me all the time in the hallway outside, before or after, they'll say, I am so afraid of saying the wrong thing at work or having what I say, taken the wrong way that I don't say anything anymore. And I don't think that's good for business. I think we should always be able to talk about stuff. Even the stuff we don't agree on, even the stuff that we don't see eye to eye on. That's where the rubber meets the road. But it can be uncomfortable in business. It is not okay to admit that though. And we all know that. You can't go to your boss and say, I don't like working with this guy.

(19:37):

He's just too different. You can't say that. If you do, it's too risky. Maybe your job would be at risk or maybe it's not at risk, but you get told that you're not on the diversity bandwagon. Or you get branded with a horrible, horrible label like racist, sexist, bigot, islamophobe, homophobe, xenophobe. If you don't know what xenophobe is, it's fear of others. Typically foreigners, what do labels do? They stick. So we know we can't risk this. And so what do we do? All of us, we keep quiet. We just don't spend as much time talking to the people who make us uncomfortable. And we tend to avoid those people as much as we can. But that doesn't mean that the struggle that we feel in trying to connect with them goes away. We're still struggling. I'm here to tell you that social psychologists say that if you are struggling to work with someone who is not like you, and it's difficult for you, you are normal, you are not a bad person, and you're definitely not alone. The struggle and discomfort that you feel is normal.

(20:50):

But let's put a little science behind this, because business doesn't run on holding hands and singing. We are the world. I'm all about it. But I also know that business doesn't run on that business runs on metrics, business runs on things we can measure for success. So while it's great to sing, we are the world. That's not really how business operates. So let's put some science behind this and put some teeth into this. Social psychologists wanted to find out what happens if we take groups of people who are alike and give them a task, and then we add in an outsider what happens to their productivity doing that task? And also how do they feel about it? So they wanted to take race and ethnicity off the table. That can get a little sticky. So what they used instead as groups of likeness were sorority sisters and fraternity brothers.

(21:41):

So they're all in college, they're all the same age, they're all in Greek life. You get it? What they did was they gave them a murder mystery to solve. Very simple little exercise. 20 minutes, that's all. They had 20 minutes to solve the murder mystery. They gave them some clues, but five minutes into the exercise, some of the groups were joined by a fourth sorority sister or a fourth fraternity brother, but from a different sorority or fraternity. So that's the outsider. You with me? It's pretty simple, right? That's the outsider. Some of the groups had an outsider, some did not. So what happened? Well, you can see this coming a mile away. Those that had the outsider solve the murder mystery better, faster, and more accurately a significant percentage of the time. But that's not where it gets interesting. Outsiders made the team better, demonstrably statistically better, more than doubling the team's chances of getting the right answer.

(22:36):

More than doubling from 29% to 60%. I'm not a statistician, but a statistician will tell you that that is statistically phenomenal. And I'm using phenomenal in the scientific adjectives word, not like, Ooh, that's unbelievable that just having an outsider more than doubled the chances of getting the right answer. And yet, paradoxically, the ones, the teams who won who had that outsider did not report feeling success. So just go with me here. So what's your name? Erica. Erica, woo-hoo. Bam. High five girl, you were on the winning team. Okay, you crushed it. That must've felt so amazing, Erica. Wow, you guys got the prize. I bet you were so excited. And Erica might say, I had no idea we were even making progress. All we did was bicker. It was so stressful. My point is, working with diverse team members felt harder because it is harder, but it produces a better outcome.

(23:43):

So I share this because it's so important to understand that when you are working with people who are not like you and it feels hard, you're not doing it wrong and you're not wrong in your perception. It is hard. That's why we don't like to do it. We would rather just take the path of least resistance, especially when it comes to work. This is hard. But the next time you find yourself in a situation where it's hard to work with somebody who's not like you, you're just not getting their perspective, you're not seeing eye to eye. Understand that you are in the middle of this process, and if you keep going, it will come to a better outcome. It's been proven time and time and time again. It's been proven. So trust the process, not the feelings. So how Kelly? How Well here are eight ways, okay?

(24:31):

The first way is to build trust. Now, every management book in the world is going to say, you've got to trust your people and they have to trust you. Great. How well social psychologists have identified there's not one kind of trust. There are two. The first is called common trust. Common trust does not have to be earned. We give it to people we don't even know automatically. Excuse me. It's the kind of trust that when you're driving down the road, you have to trust that the person on the other side of the road is not going to cross the media and hit you head on. You have no idea if they're a good driver, distracted driver. You have no choice but to put your faith in the universe. That person's going to stay on their side of the road. This morning when we had breakfast, we all had to trust that the chef didn't poison us.

(25:13):

I'm going to fly home. I have to trust that my pilot is well-trained and well-rested every single day. We have to put our very lives in the hands of people we don't know. And that's called common trust. You can't think about this or your head will explode really well. But the kind of trust that great teams have and the people working together have is called vulnerability trust and vulnerability trust has to be cultivated. Whoa, excuse me. And it has to be reciprocated. So I love this graphic because people always focus on the woman with the apple on her head and they're thinking like, holy smokes. I mean, let's just say she's my height. 5.6, 5.7. She has a little apple on her head.

(25:54):

She has to trust that that archer's aim is completely true, but he has to trust that she's not going to flinch. Because if that archer takes the perfect aim and at the last second all bets are off, this only works if they have total trust in each other. So how do you do that? Talk straight. Be honest. Even when it's hard. Have any of you ever had to give difficult moves? Raise your hand if you've had to give difficult moves to a client, to a coworker, to your team. It's tough, isn't it? And then one of the things, because we know it's difficult and we know what we're about to tell them and it's not going to be good. One of the things that we do is we sort of dance around it and we start saying, well, if it were up to me, blah, blah, blah, or I'm not in favor of this, but I have to tell you what the board has decided or whatever, stop dancing around it.

(26:48):

Talk straight. Be honest even when it's hard because if you start dancing around it, that other person is sitting there going, just tell me. They can tell when we're ducking and bobbing and weaving like that. And it's not good for your credibility. We are adults and we can handle the truth. What we cannot handle is the runaround. So show us some respect and just tell me, Kelly, sit down. I have some difficult news to share. Number one, I'm braced. And number two, I'm going to receive that. I'm still not going to like it. No one said you have to like it, but I'm not going to start crying. Okay, we can handle the truth. The other thing is use simple language. I find it very interesting that some of the largest companies in the world, when they have a real problem to solve, they do not resort to business.

(27:33):

Buzzword, bingo. You know what I'm talking about? They resort to simple language to move the ball down the field. So here's an example. Toyota's one of my clients and Toyota will tell you that they do not sell cars and trucks. They make cars and trucks. Dealers sell cars and trucks. So they're very dependent on their dealer body in order to be successful. Well, they were having a truck problem, and trucks are the highest gross profit vehicles that they have. So when truck sales are off, everything is off. You cannot make up with Corollas and Camrys, what you're missing on trucks, the numbers just don't work. So they needed truck volume. And the senior VP of sales called the top 30 truck dealers in the country together for a meeting. I was at this meeting, it was actually one of the most high level meetings I've ever been at in my life to talk about this problem. And he started the meeting with this sentence. He thanked the dealers for coming, and then they simply said, we can't hit our sales numbers unless we hit our truck numbers.

(28:30):

You don't have to be an automotive professional to understand exactly what the problem is because he's speaking so simply and clearly. So the dealers kind of nodded, and then he followed it up with more simplicity, and they simply said, what do you need from us to help you sell more trucks? Well, the dealers put their heads together for 15 minutes and came up with a list. That's not rocket science. It's all the stuff that you would expect. But the point is, there were no charts, no graphs, no PowerPoint. This entire meeting went down with those two sentences. We can't hit our sales numbers unless we hit our truck numbers. What do you need from us to help you sell more trucks? So why is this in the trust category? Because when you speak that clearly and simply, nobody walks out of a meeting like that going, I wonder what he was trying to say.

(29:21):

What do you think they meant by that? Right? There's no open for interpretation and gossip in the hallways because it's just so incredibly clear. Also, be aware that our differences are real in this politically correct world that we live in. A lot of people will say things to me like We are all the same. No, we're not. We're equal, but we're not the same. So quick story, A friend of mine, Scott, he's a retail executive. So he is been working for 30 years in the multi-unit retail environment as a regional vice president for Lowe's. Okay? Like five state territory kind of thing. Now, I'm not trying to be sexist, this is just the real, real here, but the home improvement category, it draws a lot of men to work there. All right? You guys love this stuff. Lumber, hardware, power tools. You guys like it?

(30:14):

So for 30 years, he is mostly working with guys. Then he changes jobs and he goes to work for Sally's Beauty Supply. And in the same way that the home improvement industry draws a lot of men to it, the beauty industry draws a lot of women to it. So all of a sudden, overnight, he's doing the same kind of job, but all women. And so he's been on the job like 60 days, and I take him to lunch and I'm like, Hey, Scott, how's it going? And he's like, oh my god. Oh my gosh. I mean, he's practically in the fetal position in the booth. And I'm like, what's going on? He's like, it's so different. It's so hard. And I said, what's hard about it? Retailing. You've been doing this for decades. And he goes, it's all women. And I said, right, but you knew that going in, so what's the big deal?

(31:01):

And he goes, they're so different. And I said, how? And he said, well, I was meeting my eight district managers for the very first time. So he's meeting them, they're meeting him. And he said, we start reviewing sales and one of my district manager's sales are in the toilet. And she starts crying, okay, now I pushed back on that a little bit. I'm like, she wasn't crying. She was whining, right? I know my sales. It's so embarrassing. And he goes, no, Kelly tears. Tears are coming down her face. And I said, holy smokes, what'd you do? And he goes, I had no idea what to do in 30 years at Lowe's. Nobody ever cried over sales. And I said, but seriously, Scott, what'd you do? You did something. And he goes, I did the only thing I could think to do, and it's genius. He said, talk to me.

(31:47):

Tell me what's going on and how I can help. Here's why this is genius. If you break it down, just talk to me. Let's get a conversation going. What's going on? Where's the problem or the issue so I can help you? Here's what he didn't say. He didn't say, why are you crying? Which only would've made her shut down more. And what he found by asking it this way is that she was not crying because she's sad, she was upset. And for many of us, when we get upset, it manifests itself in our eyes as water. It is a physiological response to stress. It's a physiological response to stress. It doesn't happen to everybody, but it happens to some of us. We get extremely stressed in the moment and our eyes flood with water. And then not to be sexist, but as women, then we start telling ourselves, don't cry.

(32:37):

Don't cry, don't cry. Which only makes it worse. So the point is, she was not sad or crying. She was upset because she felt like she was letting her new boss down, brand new boss first meeting with him. That's a really important insight. And once he learned that, he was able to say, you are not letting me down. I've seen your track record. You're one of the strongest district managers in the country. I'm looking forward to working with you, but clearly something is going on in your district that's affecting sales. So let's dig into that and figure out what that is. The point is we're not all the same. We are different. Now, the following two slides are going to change your life. If you drifted, this is a really good time to come back, okay? Working with women, and for those of you in sales, selling to women and working with men, and this is social psychologists. So working with women, women value expansive options, and we like seeing all of our choices. We're not overwhelmed when we're given a lot of choice. We actually feel empowered. I can look at 175 different colors of blouses, and I know I want this hot pink one because I looked at 175, and that's the one I want. I'm totally cool with that decision. Men on the other hand, want their choices simplified. Guys, there's a reason your clothes only come in three colors, okay?

(34:00):

Black Navy khaki, look at you for reals. Look at you. So all kidding aside, the magic number for men is three, not two, not four, three. Fun fact, men buy more electronics than any other consumer group. More flat screens, tablets, phones, cameras, stuff. Haven't you ever noticed that when you go shopping for electronics, all of the pricing is done in groups of three. Why? Because it works. Even stuff that's not electronics but is heavily marketed to men like tires, lawnmowers, grills, power tools, you will always see it marketed in groups of three because it works. Okay? So here's how you might use this.

(34:48):

If I'm you, and I'm not in your industry, so I'm just going to do an example here. If you are selling to a woman, prospect or client, you might say, here are all the different plans that we have. Let me walk you through these and I'll give you the highlights on each one and the benefits for you. And with a guy in that same situation, you might say, we have so many different plans. Let me walk you through our three most popular plans, our three newest, whatever. And if a guy wants more information, you can always give him more, okay? You can also use this in your personal life.

(35:25):

I have to act something out for you, okay? I have to act something out. This is what it's like at my house on a Friday night. You tell me if you can relate. I'm going to act it out. Okay? It's Friday night. It's been a long week. What do you want to do about dinner? I don't care. What do you want to do? I don't care. Do you want to go out or do you want to stay in? I don't care. Do you want to go out or do you want to stay in? If we went out, where would we go?

(36:04):

I have no idea. You decide. But if we stayed in, what would we have? I don't know. I don't even think we have anything here. This would go on every Friday night for 10 minutes. I'd pick the biggest fight. It was a terrible way to start the weekend. Okay? So once I learned this, I put it to the test, and the next Friday I went to him and I was like, T Mexican or burgers on the grill? And he is like, burgers on the grill, done. You're welcome. Okay, you can use this for the rest of you. So anyway, the point is we are different, which means that you should give people what they want. Gee, what a concept. Give people what they want. We all want what we want. Even Macy's doesn't sell the same stuff everywhere. So if you go to Salt Lake City and you go to Macy's, you're going to find a larger selection of large oversized cookware because Salt Lake City is home to the largest population of LDS, formerly known as Mormons, and a key tenant of Mormonism is larger family sizes as a whole and eating family meals together.

(37:08):

So if you have a family of six or seven, it's going to be a whole lot easier to make scrambled eggs in a large oversized skillet. If you go to Atlanta, which is home to the largest black population in the US and one of the most devout churchgoing populations in the us, you'll find a larger selection of women's church hats because many black women choose to wear church hats to church. Now, Macy's sells church hats everywhere, but you'll find a larger selection of them in Atlanta. And if you go to Seattle, which is home to the largest Asian population in the United States, you will find a larger selection of both men and women's clothing in smaller sizes as a whole, particularly on the inseam. Even Burger King doesn't sell the same stuff everywhere. If you go to New York City and you get a breakfast sandwich that is served on a bagel, and that same sandwich in Birmingham, Alabama is served on a biscuit.

(37:57):

So just a product tweak, personalized communication is really key right now. It really is because I feel like in a way, after COVID, we actually didn't kind of come out the same. We didn't come back the same way. It's just a little different. So let your clients and prospects dictate what form of communication they want, because Zoom fatigue is real. Do we agree? Holy smokes. I don't think it's healthy to just stare into the green light all day with a smile. So engage in whatever manner is best for them. When I'm talking to my clients, I'm saying, Hey, do you want a video call or a regular call? Do you want me to just email or text you? Would you rather have that call in the morning or the afternoon? One of my clients, when I said video, a regular call, she said, Kelly, can we just have a regular call?

(38:40):

Because I can walk around my house and water my plants and give you my full attention at the same time. Give people what they want. Here's what nobody wants anymore. Nobody wants your big long rambling email, okay? Because we don't actually read anymore. We skim. It's the best we can do. There's just too much information coming at us. Are you the guy that does that? Are they ribbing you for that? Do you write the big, long rambling emails? Oh my gosh, he just outed her. Okay, so long rambling email. Okay, so would you rather read this or would you rather read that, right? It's the same email. White space and bullet points are your friend, because white space and bullet points visually break up all that copy so that we can skim through it. And why do we skim? Because there's an action item in there for us.

(39:28):

There's only two reasons why somebody sends an email. They either want you to know something or they want you to do something. So if that's the case, then I'm going to put together a thoughtfully composed email. I want you to read it. So make it easy for people. In fact, our language reflects culture. So we have all these abbreviations that we use that make communications, particularly texting faster and easier. B-R-B-T-T-Y-L-I-D-K-L-O-L. I don't know if you've seen this one too long, didn't read. Yeah, for real. If you are guilty of writing these big, long, rambling emails, don't be surprised if somebody on your team sends back TLDR. They're just not going to read it. Don't do this. Collaborate. Collaborate. The best way to work with people not like you is to actually understand their ideas and be open to those ideas. Now, when somebody brings us an idea, sometimes that idea is flawed, and what we think is that we think that we're supposed to say something about that and we're supposed to go, well, that's never going to work.

(40:30):

We don't have the budget for that. We don't have the horsepower and the manpower for that. Well, that's never going to work. When somebody brings you an idea that's flawed and it happens, try to lean into it a little bit more. Tell me more about that or help me understand how you came up with that. Because sometimes the idea itself is flawed, but the thinking behind it is genius, right? So we want to get past that to that, okay? Gives the other person a chance to explain their thinking and understand the tone matters because there's a big difference between how did you come up with that and how'd you come up with that? So we don't ever want to shut down the conversation. Also, when we ask for help with our ideas, we don't want to be shut down either. And here's the thing, when you ask somebody, Hey, I've got an idea.

(41:17):

I want to run it past you, what they think you want. This isn't conscious, but what they think you want is for them to find the flaw in it and to fix it. It's kind of like an auditor. An auditor is never going to audit your taxes and go clean is a whistle. They don't feel like they've done their job until they find something, however minor it might be just some little thing. So when you are asking for help with your ideas, draw that other person into collaboration like this, Hey, I have an idea and I would like your input on how to make it stronger. Do you see what I did there? I positioned her to make it stronger, not poke holes in it that works and be open to what I call the intersection of random. The intersection of random happens every single day. It happened with Brady this morning. I would've never met Brady and been so impressed by his wonderful little cup of coffee for me that I'm going to pay it forward if there wasn't the intersection of random. So I'm going to give you my best example of the intersection of random where two people come together and maybe it shouldn't work, but somehow it did.

(42:30):

Martha Stewart and Snoop Dog, right? So they had a show and the producers put them together because they absolutely did not expect them to get along. In fact, they were actually hoping for chaos and conflict, okay? They're hoping for real housewives table flipping drama, the grand dom of New England lifestyle, and the most prolific weed smoking rapper, really. But they clicked for real, and the audience could feel that. They could feel the comradery and the true synchronicity coming off of them. So the producers were hoping for chaos and conflict, and what they got instead, were two besties.

(43:17):

So really, they truly are besties. There's no romance there. They've made that very clear. Snoop's married, but I read recently that Martha Stewart just made Snoop Dogg the executor of her estate. You do that with your best friend. You don't do that with some rando stranger. So they're the real, real. They actually attended the Olympics together. I don't know if you saw this. They went to the equestrian event and they knew they were going to get a lot of publicity. So they dressed up, of course, and there they are, right? But then if they're in Paris. And so she posted two best friends in Paris in front of the Eiffel Tower. This is real. It's the intersection of random. You couldn't have put two more different people together, but they hit it off and they're best friends. Here's my story of the intersection of random. So just real quickly, I'm self-employed, married, no kids, as I said, and my work keeps me on the road.

(44:08):

I do this about 80 times a year. So I'm on the road anywhere from 160 to 190 nights a year. So I travel alone. I sleep alone. I eat alone at least 50% of the time. It's a very solitary work. It's very solitary work. I'm not complaining. I'm good with it. I'm just telling you my story. And I didn't have any hobbies because when you're gone all the time, you don't really have time for hobbies, and you don't really even have a lot of time, time for socializing because your friends are like, Hey, you want to go to brunch on Sunday? And I'm like, I'm in Cleveland. Do you want to go to a concert? It's on this date or whatever. Oh shoot, I'm going to be in LA or whatever. So your friends, they don't pull away, but they're just more like you let us know when you're in town.

(44:48):

We're just always inviting you and you're always declining. So I didn't have any hobbies. My job is very professionally rewarding, financially rewarding, but slowly killing my soul because when you don't socialize with people, you have no hobbies. You do nothing but work and fly around. It's kind of soul crushing. Right? On top of that, I was 40 pounds overweight. There's me not at my heaviest, but one of my heavier pictures. And I had very limited time for socializing, and I was getting really burned out, and I'm eating conference food and airport food and high sodium, high fat all the time. That was my daily diet. So I go to my doctor and my doctor said, I think you should try boxing. And I thought, Ooh, yes, it would feel so great to hit something. That's not me. Okay? I have never had abs like that in my life.

(45:33):

I never will. But I thought, oh, it'll be really good to hit something. It'll just feel good. And it does okay. And I said, all right, I'll give that a try. And he said, I know a great boxing coach, and you can take lessons from him. Okay? So boxing brought me to coach Randy. Coach Randy is absolutely shredded as you can see, but he is also the gentlest, nicest guy considering he's a boxing coach. He's just one of the best souls I've ever met. And he gave me exactly what I needed, which was tough training, tough love, and a new best friend, tough training. I would show up like this and he'd be like, well, somebody's not here to work today. And I'm like, what are you talking about? I'm early. And he says, your hair's not back in a ponytail. Pull that back. You can't box with hair in your face.

(46:17):

And so we've actually traveled together, he and his girlfriend and me and my husband, we've actually gone on vacation together. And I would actually just like, if you don't mind, a little bit of a shout out here from my muscle there that you can see at my age. That's not an easy one to get. All right? So he's great. And through Randy, I met this guy named Bill because bill boxes right before I do. So I always saw Bill coming out as I was going into my lesson. We got to be social friends, a little bit chitchat here and there. It turns out that Bill is an Orvis certified fly fisherman and the kind of guy that makes bookoo bucks when you hire him for a guide to fly fish. And so I said, wow, I've never gone fly fishing. Will you take me sometime?

(46:59):

And he said yes. And so he taught me to fish. And there I am with my very first fish on my very first day. It's a trout. It's about 17 inches long, and that is the intersection of random, I'm tired, I'm burned out, I'm fat. My doctor says, try boxing. I meet Randy, who is a central figure in my life. Now Randy introduces me to Bill. All I'm saying is these things happen to us all the time. Step into it, step into it, and lean into it the next time. Alright? Agree to disagree. I'm from the Midwest and I live in Denver now, but my parents in Milwaukee raised all of us kids to be super polite and they always said, when you don't agree with someone, you just say, let's agree to disagree. So they're very polite words, but they don't work. So you blue shirt, okay, just play along with me here. Okay? I want you to say, Kelly, let's agree to disagree.

Audience Member Catherine Heather (47:59):

Kelly, let's agree to disagree.

Kelly McDonald (48:01):

Fine, we're done. Right? If I say, fine, we're done. This conversation is over. What is your name?

Audience Member Catherine Heather (48:10):

Heather,

Kelly McDonald (48:11):

Catherine, Heather, whatever. Okay, Heather. Okay. So now I want you to say to me, Kelly, I see it differently.

Audience Member Catherine Heather (48:27):

Kelly, I see it differently.

Kelly McDonald (48:29):

Tell me how you see it, Heather. You don't need to say anymore differently. But the point is, agree to disagree is a dead end. Because if Heather says to me, let's agree to disagree, and I go, fine, we're done. I don't think that's good for business. I think that we should always be able to keep talking about stuff, especially when we don't agree. That's when we actually need to dig in more and get to what that different viewpoint is. You might have a perspective or an insight that I lack and I really need to know what that is. I see it differently. We'll get you there. It doesn't shut the conversation down and expands the conversation. So it's not antagonistic. I'm not being judgmental. I'm not saying my idea is better than Heather's. I'm not being combative or picking a fight, and I'm not even trying to win Heather over to my point of view.

(49:18):

It's a simple declarative statement. I see it differently. Look at that graphic. Is it 6 0 6 or is it 9 0 9? It's both. Depends on how you see it. It's important to remember that two people can look at the exact same thing and see it differently. Also take the emotion out of it. I find in this culture right now of inclusiveness, and I'm all about it. My business is built on this, but the people feel a lot of pressure to like everybody that they work with, and they talk about how our culture at work is we're a family. Well, I don't know about your family, but mine is not all that likable. So the point is, except that you don't have to like everybody you work with, you do have to be respectful. You do have to be professional at all times, but you don't have to like everybody that you work with, it's not a requirement.

(50:13):

And I think it's possible to be part of a high performing team and still not. Like people look at a football team, not just the players, the entire team, an NFL team, any NFL team employs over 1400 people. Do you think they all like each other? No way. But when they get out there, they have a job to do and they do it. That's what they're focused on. Somebody in the military, anybody serve? Anybody here serve in a squadron or a troop? Do you think that everybody likes everybody else? No way. But when they get out there, they have a job to do and they do it. So let's see you, sir. What's your name? Chris. Chris. We don't like each other. Okay? Never have. Never will. Okay? Oil and water, baby. We just rub each other the wrong way. It is what it is, right?

(51:02):

Chris, do you think that we could sit down and do a budget forecast together, right? Yes. He thinks so. Why? Because it's a task. We can sit down and do a task. We don't have to get emotionally involved. We can sit down and do our jobs. Give yourself a little bit of break. You're not going to like everybody that you work with, and that's okay. You have to be respectful. You have to be professional. But Chris and I can sit down and do a budget forecast. Lastly, four magic words that are going to change your life. And those four words are, I need your help. Stop saying, can you help me? Can you help me? Is a yes or a no question? And you can get a no. So hey, Blondie, right there. Okay, you with the long, beautiful blonde hair? What's your name? Rachel.

(51:48):

Rachel, okay, so go with me here. Okay, so I need you to say to me, Kelly, can you help me?

Audience Member Rachel (51:58):

Can you help me?

Kelly McDonald (51:59):

I would love to Rachel, but I can't because I've got to get Heather Nielsen these numbers by three o'clock. And you know how she gets when she doesn't get the numbers on time. So I love you like a sister. I would do anything for you. I would run through walls for you, but I can't, no, I had good reason for turning her down. Very solid reason. But she's still got a no. Okay, so now go with me on this. Rachel. I need your help. You say anything else? Sure What Rachel, I need your help.

(52:35):

I'd be happy to help. Sure. What's going on? What do you need? How can I help? The bottom line is we've never met before. We've never spoken, but I know I can take any one of you in this room and I can say, I need your help. And you'll say something like, what Rachel just said, what's going on? What do you need? How can I help? Or just a flat out. Sure. Why? Because we are conditioned to help each other. That's how we've survived for all these years. As homo sapiens, we are conditioned to help each other. So people will lean into that. Whereas, can you help me? Is like, I don't know. It's kind of like if I say, if somebody calls me up and goes, Hey Kelly, what are you doing on Saturday? And I'm like, nothing. No plans. What do you have in mind?

(53:20):

And they're like, want to help me move trapped, right? We're reluctant to say, can you help me? We're reluctant to say yes until we know what it is, right? But if I say, I need your help, you're going to lean into that and go, what do you need? What's going on? How can I help? And the coolest thing is if Rachel is not even the person that can help me. What is the name of the person sitting next to you? You're slugging coffee over there. What's your name? Okay, so if Rachel is not the person who can help me, she might say, you know what, Kelly, I don't even have that information anymore, but I'm sorry, your name, I can't hear Ricktna. Okay, she does let me get her on the phone of a sudden. Rachel is now an ambassador to me and she's helping me and she's facilitating me getting the right information. This will never let you down. People like to help. So stop saying, can you help me and say instead, I need your help. It's a game changer. So I have just a couple minutes. So you're going to get one and a half minutes on this 90 seconds, turn to the person next to you and land on one thing or share one thing that really landed for you in this session that you can use and apply right away. And I'm going to cut you off in 90 seconds. Go.

(54:48):

So that's a trick that an audio guy taught me, like the audio professionals in the back when you're all talking. And if I try to talk over you and go, okay, people, let's pull it together. You can't hear me because my voice blends with yours. But if I change the frequency and I go, sh, you can hear it above all else. So the next time your people are running wild and you're trying to pull 'em together, just do that. You're welcome. Okay, real quick. Call it out real quick. Super quick. Just call something out. What'd you talk about? One thing. Three things. Three things, yes. Three things for men. Yes. Yes. What else? You don't have to like everybody. You don't have to like everybody. Let yourself off the hook. No, really? It's important. Your help. Well, I need your help. I see things. I see it differently. Fad versus truck. Fad versus trend. Big one. Yeah. Anything else? It can feel hard to be productive. It can feel hard to be productive when you're working with somebody who's not like you. And that doesn't make you a bad person. It makes you normal. What was over here? Oh, intersection of random big one. Next time it feels weird. Lean into that. No, I'm serious. What else? Anything. Give what they want. Give people what they want. Give people what they want. Even if it's, I don't want to have a video call with you or call me in the morning, not the afternoon. All right, you're a fantastic audience. Wrapping up five things to do And remember we talked about a lot working with someone, not like you can be uncomfortable and that is normal. Have conversations and not debates. Use. I see it differently. And tell me more about that. Adapt to others and their differences. Give people what they want. Men like options in three. Women like their choices to be expansive. Understand that all of you know how to read a room. Not everyone's going to fall into that. If it's clearly the opposite and the guy wants options in expansive options, just pivot. Right? But generally this is true. Talk straight and use simple language. It fosters trust, especially when it's a tough conversation and use.

(56:51):

I need your help. Okay, I see the paparazzi are here. So I'm going to give everybody a chance to take a picture of this. And I want to relieve you with my favorite proverb of all time. And that is if you want to go fast, go alone. If you want to go together, excuse me, if you want to go farther, go together. Lastly, I have a book, bestselling book by the same topic. If this was helpful to you, the book has more. And here's a QR code you can scan and it's a great book and you've been a great audience and thank you very, very, very much. Thank you.